moses_fan: why should we worry about ayin hara [Ed. note: See What is an "ayin hara"? ] etc... when if we serve Hashem he will protect us, is this not akin to superstition?

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: you don't have to worry about Ayin Hara, you can trust in Hashem

moses_fan: Then why is it mentioned in Shacharit intro. prayers?

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: That is how we trust in Hashem! We pray to Hashem that HE should take care of us and we shouldn't be subject to Ayin Hara

moses_fan: But by acknowledging it in such a fashion "protect us from Ayin Hara" are we then not setting some of us up for the "it was the Ayin Hara" that caused the .....(choose your favorite bad event)....

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: I didn't say there is no such thing as Ayin Hara, and that is not what you asked. You asked why worry about it when Hashem takes care of us. And i said Don't worry... and that is why we pray that Hashem should take care of us and we shouldn't have to woprry

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: so I don't understand your last question

moses_fan: I find it problematic (and note that there are many things that I find problematic, like reading the newspaper first thing in the morning) that we would give such credence to the existence of an Ayin Hara as to the cause of a bad (or seemingly) bad event. Is not everything hashem's will. Is not everything tied into our actions? Don't we have the power to change the way hashem treats us? Why even bother with this superstitious Ayin Hara?

moses_fan: Can you imagine Jacob saying that Laban's deception was the Ayin Hara? Aren't we smarter than that?

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: your question provides the answer. Everything is Hashem's will, and tied into our actions. So if we do something that causes Ayin Hara it can be Hashem's will that something will come out of it

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: do you know what Ayin Hara really means?

moses_fan: Evil eye, no?

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: what does that mean

moses_fan: An evil eye is like a hex that someone puts on another person.

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: no, you have the right translation, but what is the concept

moses_fan: A curse usually.

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: not really... the concept is that when someone looks too much or wrongly, they can cause G-d to look again so to speak and decide to change his mind, or bring something upon you

moses_fan: Looks too much or wrongly- what do you mean?

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: it is for example like when a teacher sees a student do something but he decides to overlook it and ignore it.... but then if other students start saying hey look what that student is doing etc. the teacher might reexamine the situation

moses_fan: So its the teacher's eye that notices the bad behavior and punishes as a result.

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: you know it happens all the time... a kid does something but only gets punished because everyone started looking and making a commotion etc.

moses_fan: so is the punishment the ayin hara? Or the avera that sent it into motion?

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: Ayin Hara is not a punishment, it is can be source of trouble

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: as explained earlier it can "reopen" an old case, or cause attention to paid to something that would have otherwise gone unnoticed

moses_fan: So repetative averot that result in punishment would be ayin hara?

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: i don't get that

moses_fan: If I steal one cookie one time - I may get a pass, but if I steal a cookie every day - I'm eventually going to get slapped.

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: that has nothing to do with Ayin Hara, that has to do with your ACIVITY

moses_fan: But how does this notion of ayin hara exist independently of our actions?

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: to go back to the analogy, that is like the student who gets away with something once and then does it again and again, and finally the teacher had enough

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: Ayin Hara is the FIRST time the student does it, and he would have gotten away with it, but someone was "looking" at him and therefore made an issue out of it so the teacher decided he can't let him get away with it

moses_fan: But in our daily lives most averot are known only to the person doing it. No one else is there to tattle. Only you and Hashem.

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: ok... i am not talking about his aveirot... hold on and i will try to explain again...

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: it is like any investigative report today... people can be moving along with life smoothly, and suddenly someone decided to shine the spotlight on them... all of the sudden all the dirt that the person has been getting away with for years start surficing and suddenly he gets in trouble for actions he did a long time ago... or suddenly he stops getting the benifits he has been getting for year

moses_fan: I think I get it. One can commit averot on day one, and then on day 3,000 something bad happens that is the result of that original avera.

moses_fan: so the ayin hara ill "come on" when things are stable and suddenly get knocked down a notch.

abbi Shlomo Chein: right... let me give you a talmudic example of Ayin Hara

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: it says to put fences around your fields so that you don't get Ayin Hara... what does this mean? It means as follows: say you are blessed with good fruits every year, and G-d for whatever reason decided to bless you... then one day some one passes by and sees all the good fruit and starts thinking, 'hey, it's not fair, i know this guy and he did such and such and such... so if he gets good fruit how come I don't get good fruit?!' - that can cause G-d to reopen the case - it is Ayin Hara - it an evil eye looking and causing commotion

moses_fan: Why would someone elses envy, an avera in itself, cause Hashem to reconsider?

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: go back to the student example... the students is eating in class.. the teacher decideds to ignore it... but if suddently three students are looking at what this kid is eating, and it starts causing a commotion, or it might start a trend now that others see it etc... the teacher will change his mind and take action for something that five minutes ago, and if no would have looked at it, he would have totally ignore it

moses_fan: Yes. I understand the example. But this 2nd person who comes by the orchard looks at it and is jealous- the jealousy of person 2 is an averah. Why would Hashem listen to someone who is committing such a basic averah?

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: it doesn't matter why the second person is doing it - the bottom line is if he has a point he has a point

moses_fan: Does that encourage people to be private with their averot?

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: it is not only about specific aveirot - it is about anything... no one wants to be scrutinized, right? we all want G-d to continue giving us good without making an issue of everyone of our deeds... so we want to keep a low profile and not flaunt our success in people's faces so it won't cause attention (- meaning an Ayin Hara)

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: of course we also pray to Hashem every morning that he shouldn't consider Ayin Haras, and just do what is good for us

moses_fan: Got the concept- modesty, I was stuck on the reward punishment concept.

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: I don't know what else I can say :-)

moses_fan: You've said a lot and been very patient. The best thing you can say is Shalom, Laila Tov.

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: when you are in the spotlight, for whatever reason, whether you are haugty, or people are nosy, but when you are in the spotlight (which is the same as Ayin Hara) more dirt is discovered about you, and you get away with less...

moses_fan: Its midnight now for me, and I've got shachrit at 6:30am

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: so we pray that Hashem shouldn't pay attention to the "tabloid"stories people are thinking about us, or anything else that might bring unwanted attention which can bring unwanted action

Rabbi Shlomo Chein: good night, and the main thing is not to worry about people but trust in G-d

moses_fan: You've made it very clear. Thank you. Got it!! Shalom.